My questions are: what were the wind speeds when NPS crews ignited these backfires to protect NPS structures; and if they ignited fire on the 28th when the winds were getting stronger and stronger, would the potential exist for backfire embers to get out of control? Approximately 14,000 residents were originally forced to evacuate. Just like the Mayor of Amity in Jaws, they didnt want the tourists to see this much reality. Standing dead hemlock burned up their trunks, to as high as 50 feet on one specimen I saw. They decided instead to monitor and to identifyon a map areas for indirect containment lines which encompassed 410 acres. His parents died in the fire in Gatlinburg . By the way, the drainage to the northwest, where NPS had placed their line, is .2 mile and ~1,000 feet vertical (77% grade) of mostly weathered rock. According to Public Information Officer Seth Butler, the Gatlinburg Fire Department and the Pigeon Forge Fire Department were dispatched to downtown Gatlinburg at 6:39 a.m. on Sunday, Oct.. I felt it urgent to get out of the woods. We couldnt go up Motor Nature Trail so we went back to Cherokee Orchard Road. It means they eliminated natural causes, such as lightning and volcano eruptions. NPS can suppress the first fire; but not the second fire? That said, it is always easier for those outside of the forest to see the big picture then those who are standing inside the trees down on the forest floor. and last updated 4:48 AM, Apr 05, 2022. Not to mention all the fallen limbs on the ground beneath them. A lot of chainsawing has been going on. Above: Chimney Tops 2 Fire at 9:37 p.m. November 28, 2016 after it had burned into Gatlinburg, Tennessee. 100-acre brush fire causes evacuations in Collier County Shelter locations could have been announced, especially encouraging people to take action during the daylight hours that day so that escaping in total darkness during an inferno of fire or not having the means to do so would not be forced on people, and they could make arrangements for their own safety. Gatlinburg is in Sevier County. Three people were killed and 14 others sent to area hospitals, Gatlinburg Fire Chief Greg Miller said Tuesday. They did too little, too late. I would like to insert the word, accountability into this discussion. Just the mechanics of this devastating wildfire without any editorial comments. I agree with you Bill that it isnt Most but whether it is a few or many isnt the point for me. Not committing firefighters to direct attack in a steep very hard to access high risk area was a good decision. This is as far as this subject needs to go; for the objective of this site is in regard to wildfire. I ran other errands and stopped by cabin to unload groceries before picking boys up from school. That said, we are now in the rebuild mode. This openness which allows for both expression of feeling and diversity of thought and ideas will be what drives our ability to fix the complex issues we are faced with, and to grow as human individuals, groups and nations. Finding out about the fire has hurt me almost as much as it did the locals. There are A lot of cheap seats in the arena filled with people who never venture onto the floor. They will be touched in their heart as deeply as anyone who has lost in the tragedy itself. Instead simply took pictures on their phone, 3. He asked them how or who we could contact to get emergency information. The earlier fire on the hill was named Chimney Tops hence the name Chimney Tops 2 for the new blaze. They were in their driveway with a water hose. It was shaking the car as we drove. As it turned out the sprinklers were far above affordable means and way outside the parameters quoted by the NFPA for the cost of a standard sprinkler system so we did not get them. Great info/synopsis of the Gatlinburg/Sevier county wildfires. Sitting in a Sevierville motel room for four days watching the fire chief, city mayor, city manager, and county mayor pat each other on the back for being Mountain Strong sickened me. But, well see what the investigation comes up with. Frankly people should lose their jobs and fault should be placed on their shoulders. When maintenance employees with GRSM drove past the Chimney Tops 2 Fire early Mondaymorning they saw that the intensity and rate of spread of the fire had increased dramatically. Why are there not more prescribed and controlled burns being conducted? That would mean your timeline of the last water drop would possibly vary 15-45 minutes depending on the helibase location and flight time to the dipsite. All you left out was Howie Long jumping out of a plane on a motorcycle with a chainsaw running and you would have knocked that thing into last century! There is only one check point access at East Parkway (Hwy. Yes my house burnt along with 520 others in North Chalet Village, village no longer but all foundations. Watch This is Now, live from the Hawaii News Now Digital Center, weekdays on KHNL at 12 p.m. and on all of our streaming platforms. It is very hard and slow to navigate through laurel stands and the thick Tennesee Barbed Wire Briar patches. On-the-ground fire suppression activity took place Monday when firefighters took defensive action to protect structures at a nearby GRSM picnic area. Humans lostfire won. This area was in the process of being logged prior to the wildfire, (supposedly started by a logging train) of 1925. Crews are currently taking down the China Bazaar and Puckers building. Even life-long locals said they had never seen rhododendren wither up before. Which is why human history keeps repeating itself over and over. It was considered a total loss after yesterdays fire. We had no significant rain in 2 months!!! Ive posted this type of questioning on other Wildfire Today articles. Politics, as we know can cloud even a clear sunny day!!! They were asleep at the wheel. I was near Gatlinburg until Saturday prior to the fire, visiting my family. We were wearing bandanas wrapped around our faces at this point. This is one of the wettest areas in the entire US, and when you do not not receive a drop of rain for months on end, you know something bad is going to happen. We are emotional beings, we feel and we have the capability to think. Five days is a generous amount of time to request and receive firefighters. The Chimney Tops fire was a wildfire being monitored given limited resources initially because of the many other ongoing fires in the region to which fire-fighting resources were committed. After the fact they called in helicopters to dump water on the fire which is what they should have done in the first place and didnt, WHY NOT? What are they doing? Thanks for the good fact based, solid coverage of the events leading up to the fire. Oct. 11, 2022, at 10:27 a.m. 1 Dead in Gatlinburg Fire That Affected Travel to Smokies. Under ideal conditions they can temporarily slow the spread, which may be effective if firefighters on the ground can move in quickly totake advantage of the short termchange in fire behavior by constructing firelines, stopping the spread at that location. One or two of those employees fall to their death because they shouldnt have been there in the first place. I am just saying that it is not necessary to lynch someone in order to hold them accountable. What caused the fire in the Smoky Mountains? The deaths in this incident can be attributed to being trapped and forced to shelter in place. We must change our minds first and then we must change our actions. I can name 14 people who deserved much better! Jeannine, its obvious that you write from the heart, and you write so well it is indeed inspirational. A temporary evacuation refuge with limited services is located at Max Hasse Community Park . Its always been this way so you have to watch who you deal with, this is why the City and County need to clean this up, this would bring down the prices of these people with signs up everywhere for clean up. I was in my cabin on 28 November and barely made it out alive. I hear of those who didnt leave until 9:00 that night. The lawsuits from an event like Gatlinburg could go on for decades. All my constructive criticisms are not targeted to Park personnel in general. Copyright 2022 WVLT. The Gatlinburg Space Needle fire (July 1992) In 1992, a fire destroyed Ripley's Gatlinburg Museum which was, at the time, located at the base of the needle. Gatlinburg Fire 2016: How It Happened & the Aftermath - PigeonForge.com Two Hawaii police departments are making moves to beef up incentives as recruiting efforts grow more competitive. In a time in which the NPS and all other government agencies are under attack and certain factions are seeking to replace all our government agencies with private for profit industry I would not ignore the possibility of anything. Most excellently put, Jeannine (you are an exceptional writer). According to a news release dated Nov. 25 from the Great Smoky Mountains National Park Public Affairs Office, the fires started on Chimney Tops Trail a few miles south of Gatlinburg, off U.S. 441 . Former Gatlinburg fire chief reflects as new wildfires burn - WTVF A high-elevation area that possessed the largest unbroken Spruce-Fir forest in the S. Appalachians. When did Gatlinburg burn . Hello Jon, for what its worth, I did some hiking in the Greenbrier area of the GSMNP back in October and didnt notice many dead hemlocks, although The Chimneys area may be different, which I havent hiked in years. High winds were to start soon and rain was 5 hours away as indicated by radar. I seriously question if bias will be discreetly worked into this agency and their review of the fire?? Branches were hitting the house with a great deal of force. A couple of weeks after hearing no hardcore news from Knox News, I wrote the editor asking if the News was still doing hardcore investigation of the fire. Intention is important, even in a court of law, intention ways heavily on the sentencing. Collaboration, open thinking and creativeness are key. Especially our local emergency workers and the Park Service. It was extremely dark and small branches and twigs were pelting our car. Personally, I have already started reconstruction on my cabin but the consensus on Chalet Village north which was 540 cabins and now stands only at 20 remaining Is that about 70% are not rebuilding for a variety of reasons . By the way, I havent seen any local media covering much for the victims since the coverage with Jerry and the pursuit of compensation. It is this same type of think tank and diversity we need in reaching a host of solutions to our complexity of problems both in this situation and in all others. So they were more concerned about NPS structures than our homes and lives? I am sure the Alum Cave trail up Mt. The fire ballooned to more than 17,000 acres when winds stronger than 80 miles per hour carried the fire down the mountain and through Gatlinburg and parts of Pigeon Forge Nov. 28. What about firefighter safety? A year or two ago, there was a small fire on Rocky Spur on the Rainbow Falls Trail up Mt. Would it be wise to implement backfire with such strong winds forecasted on top of exceptional drought and fuels? Most of the people that own property down there like me live elsewhere in the real world were things cannot be as easily shoved under the rug like they are down there. Resources = $$$=taxes. The forecasts from the 24th through the 26th did not predict the extreme weather that began Monday, November 28. Wildfire experts have been warning local government officials about the potential for a fire of this magnitude for years. And the list goes on. I bet someone of you one here would sing a different tune if you loss a big chunk of your retirement because of someone incompetence. I agree with the earlier post that if this fire had been in Southern California or other areas subject to devastating fire if it would have been managed differently. Prayers for Gatlinburg - Fairborn Daily Herald Gusts above 40 continued until 2 a.m. on Tuesday when they mostly dropped below 20 mph for the rest of the day. One Person Dead After Downtown Gatlinburg Fire Sunday I can only hope that the actions are being undertaken somewhere and by the decision-makers and leaders to think and act differently. One week before the fire, a backcountry ranger confronted people that had built a fire at Alum Cave Bluffs. Local officials dont seem to learn from past experiences, nor plan well for possible dangers. I certainly hope the investigation of the totality of fire is not pressured to conclude prematurely. How many sorties could those planes do in an single day even if they had been deployed on Even Friday?? GATLINBURG, Tenn. ( WATE) A building destroyed by fire Sunday in downtown Gatlinburg has been torn down and the investigation into the cause continues. I was on the Party Rock fire in NC and our IMET was predicting that storm event 3-4 days before it happened. Thank you for making a point of the fact that we are all human beings with faults by design so that we need each other to succeed and survive. After working full time in wildland fire for 33 years, he continues to learn, and strives to be a Student of Fire. But there have also been many times when these so called experts were thrust into a different climate or situation and they too experienced failures. 1,000 feet of rise / 0.2 mile (1,056 feet) is a slope of 94.7%, not 77%. Any time our community suffers a great loss or devastation like this, it impacts everybody, she said. Nonetheless, it is obvious to some folks that the NPS did not act aggressive enough on this fire. Hemlocks were mentioned in a number of daily updates on Inciweb because they are basically standing roman candles thanks to the spiral of limbs. It is not just officials who have not caught up with the new climate reality, it is the general public and those in the path of fire. There is simply too much BS. Report: Gatlinburg fire caused $7 million in damages. Who allowed this to happen? Crews working a Gatlinburg structure fire that began early Sunday morning discovered a body. All downtown sidewalks reopened as permanent fencing around the building was installed by the property owner following the fire. They learned. Cafe 420 and Gifts of Gatlinburg were also destroyed. OnMonday, December 5, the Incident Management Team (IMT) on the Chimney Tops 2 Fire that burned from Great Smoky Mountains National Park (GRSM) into the Gatlinburg area reported that it has caused the deaths of 14people. Chalet Village Gatlinburg, Tommy there is a class action lawsuit being formulated by a Knoxville attorney. One indicator of drought and its effect on how wildfires burn is the Keetch-Byram Drought Index(KBDI). perish, but for the 14 who did, Travelers are urged to avoid the area at this time. Visited Gatlinburg for the first time in Oct 2016. Many locals are saying the lack of evac was income driven. This is a text book example of waiting for rain and not planning for WHAT IF! I wish the Feds had kept the case instead of handing it off to the local DA. Thanksgiving Day Global Supertanker 747 is responding to wild fires in Israel. The steepness here is epic, the only way out of valleys this steep is straight down or up, your lucky not to hit a waterfall. Compare the events to their fire management manual and contradictions are present. This Park Ranger was appointed to this position in December 2014 and he took office in February 2015, so in a span of one year and nine months he managed to let the place burn and we have owned property there for 32 years and nothing remotely like this has ever happened. It was about 11:30AM when we got to downtown Gatlinburg, where I took photos of the heavy on the Parkway in town. Sandra, I agree. At 2 a.m. Monday the wind speeds recorded at Indian Grave began increasing and the direction became more consistently out of the south and southwest. When I crawled my way up Pinecrest Drive to Wiley Oakley through dense smoke, I saw a Gatlinburg pumper at the top of the hill. This is a developing story. My main purpose in commenting was to differentiate between a monitored wildfire and prescribed fire. For now there is heartbreak and hindsight on the part of every one now. milepost 316. The Spur or US 441 runs between Pigeon Forge and Gatlinburg in the Smokies. Not the best plan but the safest. In this case, there were no firefighters in a position to take direct action. Waited a month to report this event and turn over the pictures they took to forestry officials! Also, for the last several decades, NPS policies have allowed these excessive fuels to build. The Championship side, who are 19th in the table, said there have been no injuries. I am like you in that I will never be able to get a good nights sleep on the mountain again as Im all be consistently looking out the window. If you take a hands off approach with minimal management and indirectly Play God look out. Bill, correct me if I am wrong, but aircraft should be on the ground a half hour after sunset? She said I dont think its necessary for you to leave home with children and dog at this point. Heavy Rain In Pigeon Forge & Gatlinburg Tennessee (March 2023) GATLINBURG, Tennessee -- The charges have been dropped against two teens who were accused of starting the wildfires in Gatlinburg last fall. The dead hemlock had to have been of huge impact to the fire. Rain began falling late Monday night and continued until 6 a.m. Tuesday, totaling 0.78 inch at Indian Grave. It would be interesting to dig a little further on this. Then the wind comes!!! The fire could have been accidental, or it may have been intentional. They felt this was an attempt to start a forest fire and it was reported to officials. How the Historic Gatlinburg Fires Happened; a Humble Start - GovTech 2016 Great Smoky Mountains wildfires - Wikipedia Downtown Gatlinburg fire: Experts identify remains found in rubble The Knox News timeline alone has enough info for several indictments. I told him to go up and park in driveway close to where I wanted to leave the truck and that I would drive truck up. I told him there wasnt when I got there at 5 oclock but I could not even see driveways on the way up. They knew the high winds were coming days ahead of that Monday. That didnt happen here. I have a close friend on IMT in southern CO so have some familiarity with the process. Finally, the Superintendent has the power to call up all the resources which were available. Copyright 2022 WVLT. The wildfire began burning in a remote location of the park (Chimney Tops) in steep terrain with vertical cliffs and narrow rocky ridges, making access to the wildfire area . And we were lucky. Case in point is our European religious history. People in our country must get this, because for all the overwhelming issues in our country today, they keep voting many of the same politicians back into office over and over and over again expecting a different outcome. Bob headed our way. Will there be an independent, non-federal agency, through,unbiased, unedited final incident management and serious accident investigation? This should not be a time to blame and inflame, but to think and act wisely. We drove down to Calhouns complex, through their parking area and back out onto the parkway and headed east. However, an event such as the Gatlinburg fires undoubtedly leads to a can of worms that some folks would rather just sweep under the rug. Brian Blanco/Getty. My wife and I hiked to Alum Cave Bluffs Saturday, Nov. 26, while the fire was small up on the Chimneys. What the kids did was extremely wrong and they should and will be punished for it but any Philadelphia lawyer work his retainer fee well get these kids off with no more than arson and reckless endangerment. This is a failure at the city, county and state levels, as well as top FEMA, leadership. there is nothing that can address the failure of leadership at every level that contributed to that loss of life. I said Fed. Experience must be coupled with training and planning based on forecasted possibilities and even un-forecasted what ifs. If an aircraft will be en route to a lit helibase or airport, they can drop 30 minutes after sunset then fly to the lit facility. When enough folks dont take a vulnerable interest in situations and root out the evidence and real root causes to a situation, that is how cover-ups and lies live on, and the wrong people or wrong causes go unrooted. If their destination is not lit, they have to land there no later than 30 minutes after sunset. We must as you say accept that humans are emotional beings and that goes for those who lost and those who stand to perhaps lose their jobs and livelihood often for making the best decisions they could with what was available to them at the time. I wish this would turn into the biggest Court case in history. There was a yellow glow in the skies which has always been indicative of severe weather where we came from. Published: Oct. 11, 2022 at 5:31 PM PDT GATLINBURG, Tenn. (WVLT) - Four downtown Gatlinburg businesses are picking up the pieces after a fire Sunday morning destroyed their building. Death toll rises to 13 in Tennessee wildfires as grim search for On November 11 some hikers found a fire built in the middle of the trail on brushy mountain trail. GRSM firefighters spotted the new fire as they returned from responding to a report of a vehicle fire. The NPS, IMO, did not take an aggressive stance on this fire, and that is usually the case with them. Many times, as has been thoroughly vetted during the analysis the Chimney Top 2 wildfire the ONLY option is an all out aggressive, throw the world at it initial attack from air, ground and sea. We applied for the Dollywood assistance and FEMA and can get neither, Im not sure who they are helping but for us and our neighbors we arent getting anything. Some of those GSMNP personnel were trained out west and know how fast a wildfire spreads in high winds. The fire burned 38,000 acres of state managed conservation areas and private timber lands. 1 dead in Gatlinburg fire that affected travel to Smokies I was in my cabin the night of the fire and if I had spotted it a minute or so after I did I would not be alive to type this right now. What about helicopters dumping water? The mayor and many fireman lost their homes and businesses, not to mention the deaths. The Seiver County Medical Examiner's office identified the man as 54-year-old Joe Martin Bates, according to the City of Gatlinburg. The wind remained at moderate strength on Wednesday with gusts decreasing from 37 at 3 a.m. to the lower teens by the end of the day. http://henryspoetry.blogspot.com/2016/12/cabin-on-creek-and-chimneys-top-2-fire.html, http://henryspoetry.blogspot.com/2016/12/great-chimney-tops-2-fire-science.html. Guessing the fire spotted from the Chimneys, to Bullhead, then on to Twin Creeks area. Cleanup continued Tuesday, with crews piling up rubble near Traffic Light 6 on the Gatlinburg Pkwy. When I built a home here just a few years ago and wanted to have a sprinkler system installed, I was told we dont have big wildfires here. they if you limit that to local staff might not have as much fire management experience as say Yosemite or Yellowstone. We could smell smoke from the fires in NC for a month before the fire began on Chimney Tops. We had somewhat of a plan but both agreed that if we had a warning or concern we would leave because of our location and our neighborhood has no fire hydrants. Bob and I had discussions about what we would do if we were to be surprised by wildfires up Beech Branch Road with no warning. I appreciate that fine quality of writing that expresses your thoughts in an easy to read yet structured style that makes sense. No. I love the mountains, but can I feel safe again? A map posted with the Fire Information sign dated November 27 showed that the park hoped to stopthe fire before it crossed the bottom of drainages on the west, north and east sides, and the Chimney Tops Trail to the south. Bats were roosting in the church rafters and dropping feces onto the pews. The body of a person has been found in the rubble of a fire in downtown Gatlinburg, our ABC affiliate WATE reported Monday. It predicted wind gusts out of the south Monday morning of 25 mph, increasing atnoonto30 mph and to 40 mph by 6 p.m. It was so blatant and irresponsible of the media station to broadcast in this manner especially under the current circumstances. Thats why I refused to use a local contractor. He should loose his job and be prosecuted for this mess he created. On the evening of the fire, I was monitoring tornadic storms across northern Mississippi because my family were driving to Those probably did not finish burning for several days. Willow Creek Country Club Membership Fees, Articles W